The underrated skill thread.

[Burst Cancel]

Originally Posted by Kendel

The only problem with them is that when anyone runs Curses, its normally for SS. SoF/Meekness/Faint do the exact opposite of what you want when you could be running Reckless Haste.

Exactly.

Slowing down enemy attack speeds is often counterproductive in PvE. Instead, damage reduction, blocking, etc. are far better options. Put up Aegis, spread weakness/blind, and watch monsters kill themselves through SS/Empathy/Insidious/etc.

[upier]

Originally Posted by Kendel

Meekness is your friend in PvE, not Shadow of Fear. Sure its a health sac but its worth the massive increase in radius.

And the recharge never was an issue?

Originally Posted by Kendel

The only problem with them is that when anyone runs Curses, its normally for SS. SoF/Meekness/Faint do the exact opposite of what you want when you could be running Reckless Haste.

As mentioned, SoF.
Barbs.
Enfeebling.
MoP, when APed.
The reasons why I run curses.
And I am pretty sure quite a few others too.

[Xenomortis]

Originally Posted by Kendel

The only problem with them is that when anyone runs Curses, its normally for SS. SoF/Meekness/Faint do the exact opposite of what you want when you could be running Reckless Haste.

Oh please.
Shed yourself of such ignorance before you become blind.

I run curses not for SS, but for the more powerful skills it offers (Barbs, Mark of Pain, Enfeebling Blood). Shadow of Fear is not detrimental to those at all, although I find myself running RH over it anyway.
I could run SS if I wanted, but the curses line or any spec into it is not always, or even usually for SS.


My original statement on Shadow of Fear is me saying why I think Faintheartedness is generally a weak option when compared to SoF, or indeed even Meekness (but a 15e spell on a 15 sec recharge hurts).

[Hellscream The Evil]

Originally Posted by beatdownbob

Glimmer of Light.
5e c0.25 r1

Elite Spell. Heal target ally for 10...94...115 Health.
Highlight's Pvxwiki nub teams who don't know why they are asking for Word of Healing or Healer's Boon.
75% chance to cause Crying if ally is already suffering from the Pvxwiki condition. If Crying occurs you gain 10 satisfaction.
75% chance to cause RageQuit is ally is already suffering the Crying condition. If RageQuit occurs you gain 50 satisfaction.
While Glimmer of Light is on your skillbar, you are immune to the Ovis condition.



Amongst all the amazing reasons to bring this skill, not least the fascinating graphic that leaves people asking what that is, but the QQ from preprogrammed "can u bring woh?" and "bring hb?" nublets is worth it on it's own.

Absolutely comedy gold from the moment you say "If you can explain why WoH is better for the task we're about to undertake, then yes" to the moment you say "gg, thanks everybody, somebody PM that QQ ragequitter and tell him we made it without him and how quickly too!".

this is what i think lol

i use glimmer since LoD was nerfed

the PERFECT skill bar for a hero


no res because i dont die in pve :P

[Kendel]

Wow people really are pissy in this thread.

Your right, obviously by saying 'people run SS' i was actually saying 'the rest of the Curses line is useless'. Stop making kneejerk accusations based on absolutely nothing, yes i'm looking at you Xeno. Majority of people use SS when they run Curses, or more than likely, they run a Curses HERO. Does that have anything to do with Barbs/MoP? No, i believe it doesn't. Shadow of Fear/Meekness do not synergise with the elite almost everyone uses on a Curses hero. Yes they ARE powerful, they also make great triggers when your messing around running FoC spike instead of SS.

That said people do underestimate how much damage can be reduced by Weakness/SoF. But then again these people also don't understand the use of Blind, Daze and Cripple. I really do love Fevered Dreams on my Ele's hero team setup, theres something satisfying about seeing an entire mob of casters flinch as Daze is transmitted and they all get int'd.

[Improvavel]

Originally Posted by Kendel

Wow people really are pissy in this thread.

Your right, obviously by saying 'people run SS' i was actually saying 'the rest of the Curses line is useless'. Stop making kneejerk accusations based on absolutely nothing, yes i'm looking at you Xeno. Majority of people use SS when they run Curses, or more than likely, they run a Curses HERO.

The majority of people also runs HB full of heals or SF eles. So?

SS isn't the fastest killing skill in the world, but as long as your team is alive it will kill. Exchanging some of your kill speed for the enemy kill speed doesn't seem that bad of a proposition. Especially because the rest of your team kill speed is unaffected or even increased by the fact they are taking less damage and hence alive.

And btw, SS isn't exactly the best elite to give to a curses hero. Discord or some support skill like Empathic removal can be better options.

[Burst Cancel]

Originally Posted by Improvavel

SS isn't the fastest killing skill in the world, but as long as your team is alive it will kill. Exchanging some of your kill speed for the enemy kill speed doesn't seem that bad of a proposition. Especially because the rest of your team kill speed is unaffected or even increased by the fact they are taking less damage and hence alive.

Reckless Haste + Enfeebling Blood = retaining your kill speed while reducing theirs.

And that's ignoring all of the other damage reduction options you have - particularly all of the skills that blind, block, or straight-up reduce damage. Say, Aegis ... or SY! ... or protting in general. Heck, even the Earth henchmen take Ward Against Melee.

[Kendel]

Thank you Burst for basically answering for me.

Shadow of Fear won't stop Rangers interrupting or degening. It won't stop Warriors/Paragons gaining adren for attack skills and the range of problems they can be (from no problem to KD/weakness spam). It won't stop Assassins from chaining. It won't stop Dervish's spamming attack skills.

Yes SoF/Meek do have there advantages, but they can't compete with Reckless Haste (which combines well with Price of Failure) if you are running things like VoR, Empathy, SS & Price.

[Medoc]

Whenever I want a good laugh, I come to Guru. Someone takes the time to undertake a topic and may actually get a few responses that will STAY OT. However, fear not, the flaming and arguing will ensue eventually. Is this supposed to be a topic about WoH vs GL? Is it supposed to be about who has the best nec curse skills? I think not. How do you people make it through a day without veering off course? Thank-you for the hours of entertainment.

BTW, Asuran scan.

[Made In Ascalon]

Asuran Scan is underrated?

[Medoc]

Originally Posted by Made In Ascalon

Asuran Scan is underrated?

Maybe not underrated more than underutilized.

[bhavv]

This is a thread titled 'Underated Skills'.

Therefore people post which skill they think is underated and why.

Other people may see this and want to discuss the skill even further with more reasons as to why it is, or why it isnt underated, this is called a discussion.

If there was no debate between WoH / Glimmer, or about the necro curses, this would be a very boring thread indeed.

Anyhow, a lot of people in this thread simply confirm that my H/H will always be better then they are.

Originally Posted by Hellscream The Evil

this is what i think lol

i use glimmer since LoD was nerfed

the PERFECT skill bar for a hero


no res because i dont die in pve :P

Please turn hard mode on. That bar is far from perfect without any Prot Spirit and also condition removal in most of PVE.

Glimmer wont save anyone from 400+ damage spikes in HM.

The problem with GW is that monks are seen as the most important class, and in my opinion the only one that doesnt need to be excused for having an unsuitable skill bar. Now, if I were pugging on HM, and the monk in my team pinged that skillbar and refused to change it, one of us wouldnt be there anymore.

Just all the more reason why H/Hing is so much more reliable. Mhenlo > your monk hero skill bar.

I will admit that I used to hate WoH. Back before it was buffed and LoD was nerfed.

With all the current buffs to monk skill, old ones like LoD and Divine Boon should be re buffed to their former glory, that way people wont keep on playing the same skills.

The only reason why people play meta skill bars is because Anet continuously create new metas. They always nerf currently popular skills while buffing unpopular ones. This destroys the old meta and creates a new one. Rather then doing this, they should instead be keeping all elites and builds equal, but instead they always make one thing better then something else, so most people want to play the current best skills as they are buffed by Anet.

[Hellscream The Evil]

Originally Posted by bhavv

Glimmer wont save anyone from 400+ damage spikes in HM.

i vanquished all with this skill bar...i died something like...3 times? i dont use just one monk on a team of 8 -.- of course a monk cant save anyone from 400+ damage spikes. important: dont pull more than 3 groups in HM in the same moment or Tahlkora COULD not save you :P

That bar is far from perfect without any Prot Spirit and also condition removal in most of PVE.

>.< my mm got aegis and PS, the prot henchman i usually take if i'm alone removes the conditions^^

i dont want persuade nobody to use glimmer, i just like it and i found it very useful...you have 4 spaces for the mesmers skills for example, with divine spirit the hero can SPAM it for about 10 seconds, cant be interrupt, the hero continue tu use it while dazed (heroes usually block while dazed) and ... he interrupt well :P gaining a lot of energy to continue to spam it

(<italian) sorry for my bad english :P

[Kendel]

Er bhavv are you sure you quoted the right person...

Going by 15 Healing Prayers and 9 Divine Favour (since your speccing massively in Inspiration) and including cast time, recharge.

You can cast 1 GoL every 1.25 seconds and heal for 115 + 29.
You can cast a WoH every 3.75 seconds and heal for 100/215 + 29.

The thing is... why? You don't need to keep your party topped off by casting every 1.25 seconds, thats just a waste of energy. And if someones really getting spiked you want powerful heals like WoH or, in extreme cases, Infuse. I mean you can keep a party topped off by generous use of Divine Healing or Heal Party/GoLE.

[bhavv]

Oh, sorry. I meant to quote someone that was complaining about woh and necro skills being discussed.

Fixed.

As for that wasted monk bar specced with 4 inspiration skills, it is really overkill on E management as I have always found that just the two interupts on 8 inspiration are all thats required to keep a monk heroes energy bar filled up.

[YunSooJin]

Originally Posted by Hellscream The Evil

i vanquished all with this skill bar...i died something like...3 times? i dont use just one monk on a team of 8 -.- of course a monk cant save anyone from 400+ damage spikes. important: dont pull more than 3 groups in HM in the same moment or Tahlkora COULD not save you :P


>.< my mm got aegis and PS, the prot henchman i usually take if i'm alone removes the conditions^^

i dont want persuade nobody to use glimmer, i just like it and i found it very useful...you have 4 spaces for the mesmers skills for example, with divine spirit the hero can SPAM it for about 10 seconds, cant be interrupt, the hero continue tu use it while dazed (heroes usually block while dazed) and ... he interrupt well :P gaining a lot of energy to continue to spam it

(<italian) sorry for my bad english :P

you or anyone else being able to run a crappy bar in pve does not make the skill underrated or even good.

[Mad King Corn]

For my ranger, I love Marksman's wager! It rocks in most areas, except where a lot of blocking takes place.

[Xenomortis]

Originally Posted by Kendel

Wow people really are pissy in this thread.
Your right, obviously by saying 'people run SS' i was actually saying 'the rest of the Curses line is useless'. Stop making kneejerk accusations based on absolutely nothing, yes i'm looking at you Xeno. Majority of people use SS when they run Curses, or more than likely, they run a Curses HERO.

Do be careful with assumptions, people can get annoyed with them. Whilst you are most likely correct about SS in this case, do be careful.
And the statement "When anyone runs Curses, it's normally for SS" does have a strong implication with the word "for".

There's a difference between running Curses for SS, and running Curses with SS. Forgive me for snapping at something that may seem quite trivial, but there is a difference and I have a reason.
The frequency with which SS discussions comes up is quite remarkable and is enough to destroy any patience I have over the issue.

Originally Posted by Kendel

Shadow of Fear won't stop Rangers interrupting or degening. It won't stop Warriors/Paragons gaining adren for attack skills and the range of problems they can be (from no problem to KD/weakness spam). It won't stop Assassins from chaining. It won't stop Dervish's spamming attack skills.

Yes SoF/Meek do have there advantages, but they can't compete with Reckless Haste (which combines well with Price of Failure) if you are running things like VoR, Empathy, SS & Price.

I can't see anybody saying SoF is better than RH.
When I mentioned Shadow of Fear, it was merely saying:
"There's no point bringing Faintheartedness when Shadow of Fear is around, as it does almost exactly the same thing, but is AoE"

One could argue "SoF is useless when RH is around" and one might be correct, but that's a different argument altogether.

Reckless Haste has a similar (if not exactly the same) usage as Shadow of Fear, the difference is RH is a 15e spell and doesn't degenerate the use of SS/VoR/Empathy. Personally, I consider that latter issue as trivial.


With regards to PvE, RH is a clear favourite. The only downside being a slightly higher energy cost and a significantly shorter duration.

With regards to PvP, the AoE aspects of RH and SoF is often wasted. The 15 energy cost is painful with Reckless. However this discussion appears to be far more PvE oriented.

[angelsarc]

Ether Renewal is underrated and underutilized. Also, Glimmer is awesome, because it's just like Orison, except elite!1one

[Sir Seifus Halbred]

Originally Posted by bhavv

Oh, sorry. I meant to quote someone that was complaining about woh and necro skills being discussed.

Fixed.

I know you are talking to Hellscream The Evil but, no, it isn't, lol.